The Wild Photographer

National Geographic Photo Instructor, Giulia Ciampini, on the way to blend Art, Science and Storytelling in Nature Photography

• Court Whelan

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In this episode of The Wild Photographer, host Court Whelan discusses the art and science of photography with the talented Giulia Ciampini. As a photographer, educator, and conservationist, Giulia shares her journey from her first childhood photos to her current work in wildlife photography and photo instruction.

Giulia provides important points on the intersection of art and conservation, discussing her philosophy of storytelling through photography, her creative process, and the importance of mastering technical skills.She also shares practical advice for aspiring photographers, touching on gear recommendations, field techniques, and the art of curating cohesive bodies of work.

Expect to Learn:

  • How Giulia blends art and science in her photography.
  • Tips for mastering your gear and creative process.
  • The role of storytelling in creating impactful conservation photography.
  • Strategies for building a cohesive photographic style and body of work.
  • Insights into post-processing, gear selection, and fieldwork preparation.

Episode Breakdown with Timestamps:

  • [00:01:01] – Early Beginnings: Giulia recalls her first experiences with photography as a child and the influence of her background in biology and education.
  • [00:03:37] – Art vs. Documentation: Giulia shares how she balances documenting subjects with creating artistic, emotionally evocative images.
  • [00:09:25] – Hands-On Photo Instruction: Lessons from her fieldwork, including techniques for teaching photography in immersive environments.
  • [00:21:29] – Defining Style: Giulia reflects on the evolution of her photographic style and how it reflects her personal growth and environment.
  • [00:32:40] – Conservation Photography: Using images to inspire connection and action, and the importance of human-centric storytelling.
  • [00:39:07] – Post-Processing: Her approach to editing, curating cohesive work, and creating timeless images.
  • [00:45:37] – Gear Talk: Giulia discusses her favorite lenses, her new Canon R5 Mark II, and tips for traveling light with essential equipment.
  • [00:56:20] – Final Thoughts: Giulia shares her excitement for upcoming projects and where listeners can connect with her online.


This episode is kindly sponsored by:
LensRentals.com. Use WildPhotographer15 promo code for 15% off.

My Full Camera Kit:

  • Canon R5 Body
  • Canon R5 Mark II Body
  • Canon EF 16-35mm f/2.8
  • Canon RF 24-105mm f/4
  • Canon RF 100-500mm f/4.5-7.1
  • Canon RF 70-200 f/2.8
  • Canon EF Macro 100mm f/2.8
  • Canon RF 50mm f/1.8
  • Peak Design Carbon Fiber Tripod

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Speaker 1:

Hello friends, thank you so much for tuning in today. On today's episode, I sit down with Julia Ciampini, a wildlife photographer, national Geographic photo instructor and a very passionate educator. We're going to dive into a lot of things, but one of the main things we explore is this magical intersection of art, science and storytelling with a conservation twist. From her childhood adventures with her father's camera gear to guiding polar bear expeditions and really shaping conservation narratives, julia shares her journey of discovery, artistry and finding harmony between this idea of creativity, biology, conservation and photography. We dive into mastering gear, curating photographic stories and her unique approach to teaching in the field. Remember, she's a Nat Geo photo instructor, so lots to learn there. This is a conversation filled with a lot of insight and inspiration for photographers, conservationists and nature lovers in general. So let's go ahead and dive in. Before we do so, quick shout out to sponsors of the episode LensRentalscom. If you go on there and rent a lens which I always recommend doing as a way to try out different gear, new gear, experimental gear you can use wild photographer 15 as a promo code and get 15 off. So big shout out to them, big thank you to them. It is a great, great asset to be able to rent lenses with a little bit of discount on them as well. Also want to tune you and point you in the direction of courtwaylandcom, my website, what I would love for you to do. If you're interested in receiving weekly, every other week, blogs and articles on photo techniques and nature storytelling, that sort of thing is, go on my website, enter your email address and I will send some fun things straight to your inbox at relative frequency, a couple times a month. Also, if you'd like to email me directly for new ideas, questions, ideas, anything that's on your mind, wildphotographerpodcast at gmailcom is a way to get a hold of me. Wildphotographerpodcast at gmailcom.

Speaker 1:

And finally, my YouTube channel is another great way to listen to this. You might be on there right now and seeing the video, but it is a podcast so you don't have to watch. You can see my hands wave and all sorts of things. You can see our faces and our expressions and the way we chuckle and maybe snort from time to time as we laugh at each other's jokes. But nevertheless, youtube is a great way to stay in touch and also another avenue to get in touch with me If you have an idea for a future episode, a question or one of the listener questions that I dive into on my solo episodes, where you might have a camera question that I answer on air Without further ado.

Speaker 1:

Let's get into my conversation with Julia. So I listened to a webinar you did recently and you have this fascinating distinction between simply documenting something you see versus the artistic eye in creating something beautiful photographically. Can you perhaps speak to that and walk me through your process when you're seeing something beautiful and how you have perhaps trained your mind to take the photo to the next level again, from documenting to the beauty or to the artistic vision?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, that's such a brilliant question. So much photograph can so much be like a poem, and so you can capture the essence of your subject. Whether it's a place, a person, an animal, there's this essence that subject has. And if you can like, as a photographer, you have all these tools with you. You have light, you have mood, composition, color, you have your own artistic sense and your intuitive sense and if you can bring all of that and connect with your subject, you move past this, like just this document of what this is, to an interpretation, a translation of that subject into art.

Speaker 2:

And I think when I'm looking at like really phenomenal photographers work, there is this poetry in their work. They're able to go so far beyond. This is a photograph of, say, a caribou, but this is like the essence of movement and how do we show movement in our picture? It's kind of like scrapping everything that doesn't matter in the picture and getting to the core of what the subject is about. And so I think, as a photographer, if part of being able to do that or part of getting to that, is being so comfortable with your gear, that analytical side of you, where you're thinking what f-stop should I be at, what shutter speed should I be at Gets pushed aside and you can very deeply connect with the moment. And then you can be more attentive and more connected to the details.

Speaker 1:

I love that and that makes me think of something I've myself been thinking about recently, which is kind of a weird stretch, but it's the parallel to gear and photography, to like gear and method and music and I don't know if you play music or anybody out there in the audience plays music, I dabble. But I would say being comfortable with your gear, like you say, fully agree highly important is almost like knowing how to play guitar perfectly, like being a virtuoso, that's knowing your gear but then knowing the song you want to play, like the vision in your head of like, oh, this would be really cool if we, you know, did such and such, like not having any barrier to entry with making your fingers move and understanding the theory behind music, but just the creation aspect. I think that's kind of what it is. Once you get really good with your camera gear and have this scene before you, you know exactly what you want to do with it and it takes very, very little effort to translate that into the actual actions of your hands, of the gear itself, of the instrument, so to speak, to speak in this way kind of like a scientific instrument, as a camera can be at some time.

Speaker 1:

So, yeah, that's a really I love. That's super insightful about just mastering gear. I I love that you came out with that super early on in the conversation because it is highly important and it's something that comes with time. But but you can certainly add speed to that ability and that propensity, that ability to use your gear with practice and listening to conversations like this and learning from online tools. So, yeah, love that. Thank you for sharing.

Speaker 2:

It's so interesting that you're comparing this to music and how the removal of barriers allows that flow of the artistic voice, and I've been thinking about that so much, about even teaching people photography. A lot of your role as a teacher is to find the barriers that they're encountering your students are encountering and removing it. Not and as soon as you remove that barrier that you see that progress or you see that student kind of hurdle forward and then they're able to express themselves more fully. But there is those barriers to any craft and so much of our learning is how do we remove the mental barriers that we might have or the technical knowledge barriers or any of the barriers that we might encounter? How do we get rid of them?

Speaker 1:

Yeah, and you know, we're actually going in like the opposite direction today, where these cameras are getting so complicated that I think that people that aren't doing this all day, every day, they don't have the muscle memory like you or I it's hard to grapple and grasp how advanced these things are and be able to find the thing you need. And then you know, not to mention just understand, the escalating capacity of these little computers and machines that are cameras today's day and age. So, yeah, it's a super interesting analogy there and it just goes to show you that you know gear and understanding the technicalities is ultra important. It sounds like a little unromantic to say, because in some ways, photography is just a beautiful, pure art form and you think, oh gosh, well, understanding, you know how to use these little computers and even Photoshopping, which is a big part of everything today. But understanding, oh well, you know if I could just set the white balance and all these 18 other things. But at the end of the day, I mean, if you're a painter, you got to know your paintbrush pretty well and your palette and your color spectrum and how to mix colors, and it's really quite similar.

Speaker 1:

So, yes, if there's a key takeaway this early in the conversation know your gear, know the technical side of it, because then that allows you to more easily, more readily, express the art side of it. Beautiful, A hundred percent, Cool. So, Julia, I know you as a photo guide in Churchill we met, I think, a couple of years ago A hundred percent. Tell me a little bit about that aspect of your photographic journey and maybe a little bit about your approach to hands-on photo instruction in the field. And while I'd love for you to kind of cover both the land side that you know we do with our trips in Churchill and polar bears, but I'm especially personally curious about the expedition vessel side and how that comes to be, Like how it's similar, how it's different, what the style is, you know, et cetera.

Speaker 2:

So yeah, that's a wonderful question. It's funny, the first time I ever did a very immersive photography experience, it was taking a young student so high school and college age students to Panama and we did a photography program there and I think that set a stage for all the work that I do now. And so essentially we would do these photography lessons and then immediately go into the field and practice these concepts. So, for example, you'd learn about shutter speed and then that day, that afternoon we'd go out surfing. Half the students would photograph the surfing and half the students would go surfing and then they'd switch so they can practice creative techniques with surfing, like shutter speed and surfing. And then you would go to waterfalls and we'd do night painting and a lot of guided practice. So you're in the field, you've learned a concept and you're immediately putting into play. And I find my work with Nat Habb and my work with Lindblad kind of draws on that passion, that approach, where it might be a little bit different, but you share a technique or you share a way of thinking with students and then immediately, right away, they have this immersive experience where they can practice what they've learned and then get feedback on what they've done. Look at this image, what can I do to improve it? But during that moment of creation, I think it's so much better if it's like the photographer is in the moment and not judging what they're doing. They're just in the moment creating, and then after the fact kind of coming around and say what can I do better or what other things can I utilize in a moment like this?

Speaker 2:

So the ship-based expeditions are different in a few senses. We often do maybe two or three expeditions in a day, so we'll do like a hike or a zodiac ride or something from the ship. And then, kind of immediately after those few expeditions, we'll come as a big group and gather together and do what's known as recaps. Come as a big group and gather together and do what's known as recaps and these short little presentations about techniques or things that the group saw and experienced that day. And then I think the one thing both experiences are missing if I'm going to look critically at both is just that moment of guests yeah, I'm going to say this strangely but kind of being forced to create a portfolio or being forced to create a body of work as a result of their experience, and then that kind of roundtable discussion about that work. Yeah, that's interesting.

Speaker 1:

Do you ever? So? You said that that might be missing. Do you ever work with guests in the post-processing and image selection or culling aspect of things? Is that something you might work with? I imagine a little bit easier on boat-based expeditions, just because you're not moving around so much. You come back to the same place every night and there's a bit of downtime and there's no you know there's no transportation needed so you can, you know, head to the lounge after dinner and you know, work for five minutes, et cetera. Is that something you've done on trips?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, absolutely so. We'll do more like office hour style. So if anyone guest has questions or wants to go through their own process, they'll come around and we'll do things. But I love that and it's very valuable because you get to actually see how a particular photographer work they're working on, where they are, how you can help them. But I think that the community element of like let's do this together and let's learn from one another, that you often find in maybe a more formal academic setting, I think that would be a wonderful thing to bring in, even like a night of critiques, because I always found that to be a powerful place of learning if it's done in a constructive way.

Speaker 1:

What are some of the more common trends or common surprises? Maybe guests realize, upon going through their images with you, like what, what are they taking away from it? That you may be, or they may be a little bit surprised about? Like oh, I didn't. I never really thought about things this way. Obviously, everything's very subjective, but wondering if there's any specific stories that stand out, or even just trends throughout the years, where this is where guests seem to have the biggest learning moments while doing that exercise.

Speaker 2:

That's a really great question. I think what I'm seeing, or at least where my mind is as an instructor, is taking photographers from the okay, taking a great image like one powerful, great image. And how can we, instead of just having one image, how can we use a collection of images to tell stories and to say more and to show more of artistic voice and style, and so helping photographers to kind of see beyond any one image and see themselves as artists through that process? And I think, because I'm focused on that, that's something I share frequently. And so seeing students now like they'll come with an image or two that are really great and then a few days later they'll come with more of a body of work and say, oh, this image connects to this one, and through these two images I'm able to say these things, and that's really nice because they start to see themselves as storytellers more than simply photographers, and I think both are profoundly valuable. But understanding that there's so many deeper layers that we can take this art form towards is quite lovely.

Speaker 1:

Love that. Julia. What is the Julia Ciampini photo style and why? Maybe not necessarily why, but what is your photo style? I mean, I think that that's something that I'm personally quite obsessed isn't the right word, but I'm just so intrigued because every photographer has their own style. There's infinite styles and it is something that I really advise my guests, my listeners, my people to kind of define and try to pick early on. I just noticed my style personally changing over the years and wishing I would have been a little more deliberate and intentional about picking that style early on and sticking with it. But at the same time, there are new advances in Photoshop, new advances in cameras, so changing is okay. But yeah, how do you feel about that in terms of you know, should we pick a style? Do you have an innate style? Is there something you've procured or developed with that style? And yeah, tell me all about it.

Speaker 2:

That's interesting. I feel like you reflecting on your style, changing is a beautiful thing because it's going to evolve with you as an artist, right. And so who you were 20 years ago, 15 years ago, 10 years ago, even last year or two weeks ago, is going to change. And so, because your photographs are a reflection of who you are, they're inevitably going to change. There's no way to keep a style consistent, I think, but I think what you value, what you're drawn to, what you are inspired by, stays a little bit more consistent.

Speaker 2:

I find it very hard to kind of pin down my own style, especially because, like the things that I photographed in my life have changed so much, from, you know, weddings and families, to jujitsu, to wildlife, to birds, to whatever, like documentary work, to branding work. I've done a full range, but there are threads that kind of run through all of the different type of work that I do, just as a strange story. I also find this fascinating, this concept of style, and I find it interesting to look at a photographer and see what about their personality is reflected in their work, and so trying to understand who they are and how their work reflects. That is fascinating. And so there was a wedding photography couple and the husband was just this like very introverted, deeply introspective man and the wife was just this loud, extroverted, wonderful energy kind of woman and they worked together as a photography couple, so they'd shoot weddings together and her images were loud and they were colorful and she put herself in the middle of the dance floor and danced as she got her shots and they were dynamic and full of energy. And then his were very soft and quiet and were cinematic cinematic and you can feel how pensive and emotionally deep his images were. And so they both had their styles, reflecting their personalities, but together they created these beautiful albums that kind of spanned the depth, like span the range. They're more holistic as a result of who they were. I I know.

Speaker 2:

For me I really appreciate images that are maybe emotionally more evocative. I like dynamic images, a lot of movement, a lot of feeling. I love when a photographer can like almost take your hand and pull you into the scene with them, like when you feel like you're in the image with the photographer. But I do find defining my own style challenging and I think the reason like I can define someone else's style easily, but I think the reason I find it difficult to kind of come to my own is when you're looking at someone else's, you're objectively looking at the products of their artistic process, so you're just looking at the outcome. But when you look at your own, you have your subjective process in place and so you're looking at both your subjective thing and the outcome, and it's harder to kind of swim through that and get to. My style is A, b, c or D, or maybe I don't know. Yeah, that's an interesting question.

Speaker 1:

I'm floored by some of your responses because it combines the science and the artistry in a way that I've not heard anybody or any other photographer speak about it. It's really fascinating, and this idea the pragmatic idea of your photo style reflects your own personality is something so simple and obvious, but something that I don't think anybody is thinking about. I know I'm not thinking about it. The average guest that I'm with on a trip or every person out there that I come across photographing alongside, yeah, but now that I'm just running through some of my stylistic changes in the last few years and just changes in my own world, outlook and everything, and there's e eerie parallels, so you've hit on something really fascinating there.

Speaker 2:

So, yeah, go ahead yeah, if you think of, like van gogh in his blue period and how his art really, like, reflected his emotional state during that time and changed from another style. Or there was this in a totally different realm there was an artist who would draw portraits of himself every year, and there's actually two projects like this, but one where the man he would draw portraits of himself but then he went through dementia and the way the portraits changed as he was going through dementia was remarkable. And so so often our art is reflecting us and so identifying style and identifying these things is like getting a really clear sense of who you are and how you express that through your art. Yeah, but it's fascinating. I think you're an interesting person to talk to for many reasons, but I think it's more rare to find people that are scientific, like, have a science background and do these arts and so you're coming at it through your right brain and your left brain and that's always fascinating because not everyone will take it in that way.

Speaker 1:

So that's why my head feels like a washing machine. Sometimes it's this mixture of the yin and yang like a washing machine. Sometimes it's this mixture of the yin and yang. Got it noted, okay.

Speaker 1:

So, julia, I want to go back to style on a little bit more of like a empirical sense. Like I do want to hear how you define your own style, not so much in like the style of like how do you approach a photograph, or what do you look for, or what photos aren't you taking versus those that you take oodles of more like your finished product. Simple in using kind of strong differences of light and dark, or going to the opposite end of just extremely even lighting. So, like I kind of like to play both sides. I'm just wondering if you could again kind of observe your own photographs. How would you describe them in terms of the colors, the light, the you know, all those kind of more digital nuances that, of course, all come together in this beautifully artistic vision? But yeah, just kind of like the raw components of your style. I'm just very curious to hear how you describe that.

Speaker 2:

This is such a complex question for me. I'll give you the reason. For example, in Panama and Colombia, I would say I'm so drawn to bright and colorful and loud and expressive movement is a big thing and color is such an important part of that. But then you go to the Arctic, right, you go to Svalbard and color it doesn't exist in that same way. And so you still may play with the color palette and you still may play with the meaning behind each color and kind of pulling together that way, but color is not the same behind each color. And then kind of pulling together that way, but color is not the same, and so it like where I am has dictated how I'm shooting in some ways, but I would say a thread that runs through is maybe like okay, maybe stylistically I'm more drawn to using longer lenses, so I love that like compressed and intimate feel through the longer lenses.

Speaker 2:

I would find my images tend to be drawn to details more than any kind of extreme-wide perspectives. I really am drawn to detail and moment. Light is such a huge component and any time that I can play with light in a creative way, or color in a creative way, that's going to be at the forefront or color in a creative way that's going to be at the forefront. Beyond that, I think it's pretty like I go through my portfolio and sometimes I find it very hard to create cohesive bodies of work because but then I've had people say like stylistically, these are your photographs. Like I could tell they're from you based on how you see, so maybe it's just the way I'm struggling with doing that for myself.

Speaker 1:

Well, we're going to come back to more on this, because I want to hear a little bit more about, like kind of your editing Photoshop style and workflow or I shouldn't use the word style anymore, we're past that but your Photoshopping techniques. But yeah, you know my takeaway from that observing you observe your own style. I think you are. You're kind of explaining how you are adaptable to your environment. You're infinitely adaptable like a good biologist. So kudos to that. That's fantastic. I want to kind of come back to something you said before well a few times, which is a big part of your career and your life, which is kind of like lifestyle photography, portraits, weddings. It sounded like you said jujitsu. I have to say I just did jujitsu for the first time in my life the other day and like my wrist is aching, my throat is still like bruised from getting choked out. Yeah, I don't know if it's for me, but I might stick with it or yeah, who knows. Anyway, that's an aside, do you do jujitsu?

Speaker 2:

I do and like for the first. I haven't done it since COVID, but I was doing it very regularly and I'd come home and like my body would be bruised. Everyone thought maybe not the greatest thoughts, but it was all from jujitsu and I think it's one of the best sports in the world and I stick with it.

Speaker 1:

It is amazing. It's so funny because, like you know, I went into this hearing from friends that do it and you know talking about how it's this wonderfully cerebral thing and you know I'm going into it being like you know, it does sound kind of like a puzzle and we're totally going off to script. Here we're, we're deviating from photography, but we're going to come back very soon. Folks, we just need to talk about getting beat up. But but yeah, like I guess it just didn't occur to me that you were like fully trying to basically beat the other person up no striking, but like you're going to take them down. And yeah, I was not expecting that, but nevertheless, like you know, I'm just going in on like a Tuesday before work like, yeah, I'm just gonna go get a good sweat on it's like.

Speaker 2:

No, I just got like thrown to the mat, tossed around, choked out, like okay, like tell me that will help you in every single aspect of your life, because if you can keep your cool in that situation, you can keep your cool in any situation and and it is so much that creative problem solving it I think you would love, like keep going to get beaten up. Enjoy it, it's, it's fantastic touche.

Speaker 1:

No, that's I like that. Yeah. Yeah, when you do hard things, it does make the unavoidable hard things in your life that much more tolerable and sometimes even enjoyable. So, yeah, touche, but anyway, where I was going with that, as you said, you photographed jujitsu and I just going to ask kind of a I'll be quick with this question because I feel like I've lost half my audience at this point. But what lessons do you take between the worlds of photographing landscapes and wildlife and travel that part of your career and the portrait wedding photographer either direction or both directions or just one Like? What lessons have you learned from the field that gets you into portrait photography and vice versa?

Speaker 2:

That's really great. With portrait photography it can get boring relatively quickly in the sense that if you treat every client like they're the same person and you're doing the same thing over and over again, you've kind of missed the point. So with portrait photography it was like how can I get to know this family and how is this family unique compared to this one or this one day special? And I definitely will use that same kind of thought process anytime I'm traveling. What makes this particular place special? And how can I photograph the essence of this place compared to that place? Compared to that place, how can I pull out what's wonderful about it from it? And the same with wildlife.

Speaker 2:

I think in portrait photography and wildlife photography and in travel photography, it's you being very attentive to your surrounding and you being able to connect with your subject in various ways. And so as you travel, a lot of it comes from who you like. I think a lot of photography comes from who you are as a person, and so if I'm photographing a person I'm doing a wedding with, versus I'm photographing like a travel portrait in some far-off place of the world where I don't know maybe someone or the language or any of that. I think there's like a gentleness in the way that you can approach things that makes people feel comfortable and makes people allow you into the world, and then you can kind of cut around a lot of the masks and pretenses and the things that can be barriers. So I think the approach is very similar, just the subject matter changes.

Speaker 1:

What would the Julia of today tell the Julia just starting out in her photographic journey?

Speaker 2:

This question may be rather sentimental, because in my 20s I felt quite lost. I knew I loved biology and education and photography, but I didn't know of a way to kind of combine them all. I mean, it wasn't until I started doing this kind of work that it all came together. So I think back to that like 20-year-old self and if I could tell her any one thing is things will happen if you make them happen, but if you embrace rejection and make rejection a metric of success. So how much did you put yourself out there? How much did you apply for? How much did you push to grow? What are you doing?

Speaker 2:

It doesn't matter if you get rejected. It doesn't matter if you submit something for publication or you apply for a job. None of that matters. What matters is that you're putting the effort towards your goals. And I think, yeah, using rejection as a metric of success. And also, if I can go back in time, I would read this book Mindset by Carol Dueck. It was one of the best books I read, but I read it quite late in life. Do you also have it?

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I was going through your book. Here we go.

Speaker 2:

Also a great book.

Speaker 1:

We'll just put this right on top here for the camera. Yeah, it's a good one.

Speaker 2:

I was going through your book list I'm like, okay, that one's a great one, that one's a great one. Yeah, that one was a, really, I think, where I was.

Speaker 1:

It was a profoundly meaningful book for me. Fantastic. So you've touched on several times, including in this most recent question, the intersection of photography and conservation. How do you use photography as a conservation tool and you know? What advice do you have for others that are keen to do the same? We know that there are. We know where the options are for photography for the most part, but are there any options that people may not be thinking about as obvious places, or are there certain areas that are more important than others, that are just being underutilized?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, see, I wanted to ask you this question when you sent me the list of questions and you gave me this question. I wanted to ask you because you're more in this realm of conservation work and I think it's such extremely valuable work to be done. Right now I work with an organization called the Canadian Collective of Conservation Photographers and they're some brilliant photographers and they do a lot of campaigns related to wildlife of Canada and also, I find, with myself. I intentionally chosen to work with organizations like NADHAB or Lindblad that have conservation at a forefront and so like interacting with guests but helping them connect to nature and helping them see why it is an important thing to care for, and that is at the forefront of my guiding.

Speaker 2:

But what I would love to do with my own self and my own work is when I am at home I'd love to tell more conservation stories, and so I'd love to be able to like work with particular organizations and bring that skill set to them.

Speaker 2:

I just haven't had a chance to kind of figure that component out, but like if you can align yourself with organizations whose values mirror your own and you can support them with your creative voice and creative gift oftentimes the images can help promote change, and I think one thing that I do that is fairly important, unique in the world of wildlife photographers is I do have such a background in portrait photography and there's this study about like images that are impactful for conservation photography and they looked at. Yes, beautiful images of wildlife and beautiful images of ecosystems are important, but if you can show the human connection to these places, if you can show how humans are interacting and helping and showcase more of those stories, you have this vehicle that your viewer can now connect to the human part of it and then they can get more involved, and so I think that's there's something in that.

Speaker 1:

There are so many ways to do this, and part of the reason I ask this with almost every guest is that I'm just curious what the other options are out there, like I kind of know what you know, submitting them to conservation organizations and magazines and newsletters, and you know you can do your own storytelling on social media and putting in some conservation tidbits you've learned from the trip while you're taking the photograph. But you hit on something here that is really quite interesting and it's telling the deeper story and I think that that is one thing. If people wish to intersect conservation and photography and do sort of more powerful way, starting with their next photographic outing yeah, it's to you know maybe sacrifice the classic portrait of the lion, that you know, frankly, everybody has in.

Speaker 1:

You know you're going to see dozens of lions and, of course, of an African safari. So maybe that one time you sacrifice that classic portrait and instead you photograph the reaction of your guide as he or she is looking at it and kind of telling the story. Instead you put your ultra wide angle lens on and photograph the entire vehicle with everybody in it enamored and obsessed with this photo and telling that behind the scenes story.

Speaker 1:

I think that that's something that it's really hard for people to do, because you've spent a lot of time getting there and paid a lot of money to get there and you want that photo. You have this expectation in your mind of like the perfect lion portrait. Maybe you didn't get it so far and maybe you don't know if you're going to see a lion again just using examples of some rando animal here. But it's hard to get people to pull away, and that's definitely something I've learned over the last few years, because so much of how I use my photography today is in telling the story of travel and this happens to be conservation travel and so oftentimes, when I'm in front of the most extraordinary sighting, I switch my lens out from telephoto to a wide angle and photograph the photographers or photograph the observers or, you know, photograph what the entire scene looked like, like a wildlife in landscape shot. And the other thing that I'll say is that you know, when people are faced with this question, it's it is always a quality versus quantity thing.

Speaker 1:

You can have really, really extraordinary photographs and you won't need to search very hard or you won't need to put them in a lot of places for them to have, you know, a certain amount of impact, but that sometimes can be a lifetime of work.

Speaker 1:

Sometimes that can be having to be a pro photographer or someone that travels 250 days a year, like you do. But for other people, sometimes, you know, if you don't have those photos that are truly otherworldly in terms of their quality, you know one of a kind, truly one of a kind. You know it is a quantity thing, it's. You know how can you take those 50 photos that you selected as the best of the best from your trip and post them every day on social media with a conservation tidbit, or, you know, not every day, but every week, whatever you think, and then it turns into a quantity thing. So, yeah, I don't. I certainly don't have the answer. I think it's. It's trial and error, I think it's learning from others and experimenting, and a lot of it's finding your own path through right. But hence why I ask each and every person that question.

Speaker 2:

I would like to get better at it as well I feel like so much of this is bushwhacking, yeah, like, because it's an individual process. You're you're in the field and you're just hacking your own way forward and other people are doing similar and you're figuring it out as you go. But I I think you hit on a lot of like really important things there. For example, like with polar bear season, it is so phenomenal to be able to photograph like a beautiful polar bear in their environment. But then the reactions of their guests a guest who has been waiting to see that polar bear for their entire life and has done so much to get to this trip and like to take one second and look at the tears that are streaming down their face because it's been such a moving experience for them If they're more connected, if you can show how connected, like I think a lot of our issues that exist right now is because we are disconnected from nature, and I think one of the powerful tools we have as a photographer is really helping people connect to the natural world, and I think one of the powerful tools we have as a photographer is really helping people connect to the natural world, and so I find, even when I'm guiding, if there's this one-of-a-kind experience where a bear is coming up to the rover and being with us.

Speaker 2:

I try to be as quiet as possible so that each person can really engage and be present and connect to that experience. Because if I describe the bear's behavior in the moment, that experience, because they're like if I described the bear's behavior in the moment, that's great and that's wonderful, but I'm taking them out of that moment. So how can we do all our photography stuff before and after and allow the people to connect with their experience? And I think that's a part of it that I'm like there's a nuance there that I'm figuring out slowly as a guide.

Speaker 1:

So I know I have hopefully have a lot of young aspiring photographers in the audience, and what is a lesson that you would like to teach aspiring nature and wildlife photographers?

Speaker 2:

This is a strange example, but one of my first contracts with Lynn Vlad. I sat beside the editor of National Geographic Travel the editor of National Geographic Travel, and he was there as an expert and to be part of the trip as a cultural expert. And we were sitting for dinner and it was my very first trip and he was saying like and this man is like published all kinds, he's a brilliant writer, he's written so many books, he's the editor of National Geographic Travel, he's like right up there and he said like I don't know why they've chosen me to do this thing. And so he was feeling that like sense of imposter syndrome.

Speaker 2:

And I think, if I were to talk to any young photographer, it's like you are going to encounter so many things in your journey throughout your life. You're going to encounter like imposter syndrome and doubt and anxiety and you're going to feel overwhelmed and you're going to have all these experiences. But these are human problems. They're not you specific problems, especially if you're going into that like more artistic side. These are just human problems and so you'll feel them regularly. They don't go away, but the great thing is they're not you problems and so it is very much a sign that you're doing something, pushing past your boundaries, and that's a great thing. And so, as you go through this journey, you're going to encounter a lot of success and a lot of failure, and that's all part of it, and it's exciting.

Speaker 1:

That's beautiful. I love that. Okay, last question here, before we get into talking about gear, which I always love to nerd out on, and I know you're a fellow Canon user and, for whatever reason, I don't encounter a ton of those these days, although they are extraordinary platform that I'm still very happy with. But before that, how do you approach post processing? And I'm going to keep that kind of ambiguous, because you can about however you'd like, if it's more of a stylistic thing or more of a workflow thing, yeah, how do you approach it?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, really great. I love post-processing. I think it's like as a strange Italian analogy when you're shooting, you're collecting good ingredients. When you're post-processing you get to make the meal, and the better your ingredient it's, the better your meal. So while you're shooting, you're getting the most beautiful file you can. You know, solid exposure, perfect focus, whatever it is that you're looking for, getting it right in camera. And then you get to go home and really enjoy the process of editing.

Speaker 2:

And for me, I'll put on a fire, I'll put on a murder mystery or a documentary and just like spend an evening working with my images. One thing that has helped me quite a bit is rating the images in camera beforehand so that when I throw my images into Lightroom I can just immediately select for my ones or my threes. I'll rate them like a decent image is one and a three is kind of a more outstanding image, one I want to spend more time with, and I just pull all the images into Lightroom and then I can just immediately select for those images and kind of ignore all the rest.

Speaker 1:

And the data is there in the photo itself.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, so like, what you rate on your camera will translate right into Lightroom.

Speaker 1:

Interesting.

Speaker 2:

Fantastic. Yeah, it saves me from overwhelm, though you do still have to like download everything. But there might be a way to download just your ones or just your threes. Like for the editing itself, I do find I like to keep things as timeless as possible, so I've never been one. For you know trends With wedding photography. You'd find like every year there was a new trend and you could tell immediately when the image was taken. Like I'd rather my images, kind of like you don't know what year they were taken, it's just a decent photograph of this thing. But it'll be like minor corrections, white balance, spot removal, kind of making a raw file a little bit more punchy. And then what I would like to spend a lot more time doing is kind of curating my images down to the best and then making cohesive bodies of work, cohesive stories or cohesive bodies. I think that's where my brain is at lately, but really taking my time with the editing process. It's fun, it's really joyful.

Speaker 1:

And so part of your organization is not just having the, you know Churchill 2024 album, but you're actually pulling out photos and creating bodies of work that might be Arctic landscapes or bears in fall. Is that what you mean?

Speaker 2:

Yeah. So it's interesting because I think about, like, what is the purpose of an image? So is it going to live on my website? Is it going to go to social media? Is it going to do any of these things?

Speaker 2:

And one of the things that I have on the back of the mind is this just like you have to update your website. It's been two years, you've done 50 trips. You haven't updated your website in a very, very long time. Update your website. And so I'm trying to think of, like, what type of work do I want to do in the future and what kind of work do I have that reflects that work that I want to do in the future, and then create work based on that. And so things like Arctic travel, for example, I'm doing a lot more travel in the north and so, like I'd love to get up to do the Northwest Passage or the High Canadian Arctic, and so can I pull together all my images from Svalbard and Northern Canada, churchill, all these different Arctic kind of ecosystems, and pull that together in a cohesive body, which is not easy.

Speaker 1:

How do you decide what photos get that elevated status?

Speaker 2:

I think part of it is instinctual, part of it is like there's something about this photograph that feels magical in some way. But, like you and I were just discussing a few days ago with the photography contest at NADHAB, what makes a great image? A great image and you have to like it has to be technically sound, there has to be some thought of composition and some arrangement that the photographer has made to create a good image, and then there's that artistic quality and voice, and so there's all these different components you kind of go through, but sometimes I'll just like sit with two images side by side if I'm debating and just like on instinct what one feels more harmonious or is more aligned with what I want to say.

Speaker 1:

Okay, so time to move on to nerdy gear talk, my favorite segment Julia. Julia, what are you shooting on?

Speaker 2:

Right now at Canon R5, and then I just just just bought a Canon R5 Mark II.

Speaker 1:

Have you played with it? Any initial feedback of the Mark II?

Speaker 2:

I bought it just before polar bear season. Got it the day before I left polar bear season. Have you played with it? Any initial feedback of the Mark II? What I feel is a big improvement on the R5 is the way in which they allow you to get to your video. It's much more seamless, like you can be shooting, shooting, shooting and then very seamlessly move to taking video. So this past fall of our season, I did, I would say, more video than I did photography, which is quite new for me.

Speaker 1:

Any other standout features of the Mark II versus the first one?

Speaker 2:

Not just yet, but it is like a high frame.

Speaker 1:

Better ISO, that sort of stuff.

Speaker 2:

Just a very nice camera Higher frames per second if you go to your burst mode. It's a beautiful, beautiful camera to use. It's similar with the other, but I find also the focus seems to latch on, to focus a little bit better, which is quite nice. But I still have to spend some real time with that camera. I was listening to a master class with Paul Nicklin and he was saying put your camera in a dark room with you, close your eyes and be able to change your settings based on how well you know your camera. And I haven't done that yet with this one. But I think it's a valuable thing to do, especially for northern light season, when it's dark and you can't can't see anything fully agree with that.

Speaker 1:

So I was going to ask what your favorite lens is for wildlife photography. But I we were talking before we started recording and you said you have gotten some, some new gears, maybe some new lenses. So yeah, talk to me maybe about like your suite of favorite lenses right now.

Speaker 2:

As a favorite all-time lens, I think my 70-200. I just love that 2.8. It's a beautiful, beautiful lens For wildlife, though I find often wildlife is quite far.

Speaker 1:

It's just not enough, and so having that little bit, it's just not enough.

Speaker 2:

So before shooting with 100 to 500 and I just recently got the 200 to 800, 6, 3 to 9. I haven't it's still in the box. It's in the box right behind me. I got it for my birthday and I'm excited to use it. I'll be in Panama and Costa Rica in a few days and so I'm excited to get it out and play with it there, particularly for birds and wildlife. I'm very much in the moment of like reconsidering the wide aspect of my kit, because I look at other photographers' work and I really appreciate how certain photographers utilize their wide angle and think in that way, and I've not been as effective in that way. So I'd like to like force myself to play in those focal lengths to kind of get there better. How are you? What's your kit like?

Speaker 1:

Yeah, so it's pretty similar. I recently picked up the 7200 that I had sold a long time ago and I kind of regretted it and it's you know I tried to go minimalist and I got back into it. I honestly would rather have that lens than the 100 to 500. I do like the one to five like it's. It's super sharp, it's you know the range is incredible. I'm just a stickler for aperture, like I. Just I really don't like shooting at 7.1 unless I intend to and frankly, a 7.1 aperture on a lens that is the maximum aperture doesn't look like if you're doing on 7.1 where you're shooting on like an F4, f2.8. So, yeah, I like it. Honestly, I'm very much coveting the 100-300mm f2.8. I knew exactly where I'm going to make the incision to cut my kidney out in order to get that lens. I'm going to go just the side of the abdomen, it's a very expensive lens.

Speaker 1:

It's hard to justify because 300 isn't that much more than 200, but you know it is yeah. And then you know I did pick up the Canon 15 to 35 within the last year and it's awesome I it is crazy sharp. It's an expensive lens as well, but compared to my 24 105 it is a really really sharp lens. You know the 2.8 yeah, yeah it is 2.8 yeah.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I mean, it's like the perfect night aurora lens. I think I did shoot the aurora with it. You know, the thing with ultra wides is people often think an ultra wide is great for landscapes and it's like, okay, I'm going on a big landscape trip Like I'm actually headed to the Himalayas in the next couple of months on a personal trip. I'm like, do I bring that? And the reality is like it's almost the opposite. The ultra wide is great for when things aren't big and impressive and you need to make them look like that. But when you're in a big scenery, you know, ultra wide, just it. It does the opposite of zoom compression and it just makes big, impressive things look very small. So it's way more of like a lifestyle travel lens, which I do like it for, you know, taking photos for catalogs and magazines and all that.

Speaker 1:

It's a great lens to get everything in the frame. And then you know, can't do without my nifty 50. Get everything in the frame and then you know, can't do without my nifty 50. I love my nifty 50. Canon just came out with an upgraded version of the little 50 millimeter 1.8. That is inexpensive relative to a lot of these other things just a couple hundred bucks, but their new f 1.4 version a little bit more money, but probably something. Something I'm going to potentially consider Because I love the 50 millimeter range.

Speaker 2:

But honestly.

Speaker 1:

I'm thinking of renting from LensRentalscom, sponsor of this episode. I'm thinking about renting either the 100-300 or the get this, the 400 F2.8, for my next Borneo trip. I've never had a 400-28. Then I have to take both kidneys and I don't know how long I'll be able to last without both of them.

Speaker 2:

but you know when you, when you rent it, it's definitely not as hurtful honestly, that sounds like a brilliant idea, and you'll have so much fun with that in your hands, like it it's just wild when you start to count the amount.

Speaker 1:

You know how much more light you have compared to a f7.1, f8, f9, it's just like. You know. Okay, you know from from f8 to f5, that's twice as much. F5 to f4, that's four times as much. You know f4 to 2.8, you know, do the math like you're. Just, you have like eight times the light. You know it's a big piece of glass, but anyway, yeah, any any other lenses that you've played around with from the canon lineup, or really any lineup that you, it's worth canon's been my, my go-to and, like before, I did wildlife photography, I was shooting on like my what okay?

Speaker 2:

canon 5d mark 2, mark 3, mark 4, and I Canon 5D Mark II, mark III, mark IV, and I had like a variety of prime lenses. A lot of wedding work was a lot of prime work, and I'm just trying to like justify the room in my bag, because that's what I find very challenging is, if you're traveling with everything that you need on your back and this past year I ended up traveling to like 12 different programs back to back and I'd go from, like Svalbard to Galapagos, and so I needed everything for both trips in one bag, plus camera gear and so how do you make that make sense? You can't, and so you have to keep your kit as small as possible, or your clothing as small as possible, which it ends up being your clothing. You keep as small as possible, which it ends up being your clothing. They keep as small as possible, but it's challenging. The whole packing in travel photography is tricky.

Speaker 1:

Do you ever use Canon's 85mm f1.2 prime? I love that lens.

Speaker 2:

That was in my like portrait wedding, heavy, heavy days. That was my favorite lens. What I have found is, typically I'll shoot with two bodies and I'll have like more of the focal lengths covered. So in my wedding days I might have, like I don't know, a 24 to 70 or like a 70 to 200 on one body and then an 85 or a hundred on the other, and so you're getting different looks and feels with the different lenses you have. And I'm finding with this new purchase of the Mark II, I'm able to shoot again with two bodies and I love that. It makes me feel like I'm back and like you can tell more of the story in the immediate moment. So when you were talking about like taking a moment to step away from the lion and then catch that shot, being able to not have to change lenses is so helpful.

Speaker 1:

It's a game changer. I've I've gotten down to one body, just kind of like you were saying, to be a minimalist and to fit in suitcases and not having to compromise lenses, but oh, to have a second camera body. It really is. You truly double your shots. I mean, you end up getting twice as many photos, twice as much diversity.

Speaker 2:

It's, yeah, it's a great one I've been thinking a lot of like if you're in the field for eight hours but the only shot you're taking is the same shot over and, over and over again. You're basically in the field for five minutes, right, so you can, if you can, come up any situation and really expand that breadth and that range, you're getting more from it, you get a richer experience as a result.

Speaker 1:

But yeah, so you travel lot. We've heard this and I know this personally. What packing or prepping advice do you have for photographers out there? And this may be photographic centric, you know, gear centric, or it might just be something that alleviates the rest of it so you can concentrate more on gear. But, yeah, what's what's like some of your best tips or tip on that?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, this is such a great question because each time I go I try to refine and refine and refine. So something like a bag that I have behind me. It's a bag that is on wheels but it also has straps. What I found is in the airports, planes will be overbooked and they'll always ask you if you have a bag on wheels to check that bag, and I can't check in my camera gear. So having a bag where I can quickly throw it on my back and people don't know that it's a big camera bag has helped save me in that moment.

Speaker 2:

Things as simply as like separating batteries from the rest of your camera gear I find I'm always, always stopped in security because the batteries are so dense and they can't be scanned, so they need to like go through them again. So putting all my batteries in one space, I can very quickly remove those, and that's been helpful. Having charging ports that charge more than one battery at a time On the ship I usually get like one charger and you're in the field for however many hours your one battery won't last. So having something like this with three ports, I can get through a lot of batteries.

Speaker 1:

I'm going to jump in here and second that statement. That's been a huge game changer for me. So for those listeners out there that don't yet have a battery charger that can charge two or three batteries at a time, it is so worth the investment. It seems like a small thing, but when you can pop on all batteries overnight and wake up in the morning with your entire suite of batteries charged and fresh and ready, it just takes so much worry, takes so much risk out of the situation.

Speaker 2:

It's yeah, that's a huge one and something as simple as like a little case like this where I can throw in some camera cards and then batteries as well, that I can keep in my jacket pocket. So I don't have to go back to my kit if I've run out of batteries or if I need to change cards. I just can immediately take what I need from my kit or like from my pocket. That's been helpful. But I find like you don't need all the big lenses, you don't need everything. They tell amazing photographic stories, and so keeping the kit tight is quite effective, but I will always sacrifice on clothes, and so keeping the kit tight is quite effective, but I will always sacrifice on clothes and I will always like it's functional reform for me and I'm like I'd rather have camera gear than look nice.

Speaker 2:

So echo that just yeah, just the way it is.

Speaker 1:

Okay. So final question here, and you may have already covered it in what you just said, but maybe you do have something else out there that's lurking. That's another great piece of gear advice Do you have any pieces of gear for nature photography that are surprisingly helpful that people may not think about?

Speaker 2:

And this wasn't at all photographic gear, but a notebook and a pen.

Speaker 2:

Like every single time that I'm in a field, I will learn a lot, and it either like learning about particular animal behaviors, or you're learning something new with your camera or you're thinking about what you would like to try in the next situation.

Speaker 2:

So, very quickly, jotting that down in a small notebook little field notebook is wonderful, but also it's not so much a piece of gear but it's a practice, and what I have found that has been very meaningful for me is in all the circumstances where you're kind of just in the field, waiting for something to happen, waiting for wildlife, waiting for whatever, you have all this downtime that you could be using to learn your camera better and so using that downtime more effectively. It's just like what I'll do with guests, for example, in our vehicles, when we're searching for bears. We'll really go through our camera settings, we'll run through things, we'll practice things before the moment of bears or after the moment of bears, and so you're doing a lot of that legwork then, and so it's not at all gear that you bring into the field, but it's this practice of downtime is still on time and you can use that time very effectively.

Speaker 1:

Excellent advice. Well, julia, thank you so much for joining me today. Where can people find you Website, social? Where are you at?

Speaker 2:

It's juliaciampinicom, but it's spelled strangely.

Speaker 1:

I'll put that in the show notes, folks.

Speaker 2:

And, but it's spelled strangely. I'll put that in the show notes, folks. And then my Instagram is at juliaexpedition. Yeah, and hello at juliaciampdphotographycom. But you can add that that would be great.

Speaker 1:

Excellent. Well, Julia, I've learned a lot. I know folks in the audience have learned a lot. Thank you so much for sharing your wisdom, your insight, your artistry.

Speaker 2:

Lots to take away from this one, and great to speak with you, as always. Can I also thank you? I feel like I've put some things together and you're you're absolutely brilliant.

Speaker 1:

And thank you very much for this.

Speaker 2:

This was lovely Pleasure.

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